IPP Mail Archive: Re: IPP> Re: MOD OLD NEW Issue: Contradictory NLO requirements

Re: IPP> Re: MOD OLD NEW Issue: Contradictory NLO requirements

Robert Herriot (robert.herriot@Eng.Sun.COM)
Thu, 08 Oct 1998 19:23:28 -0700

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Tom Hastings: NOTE this is another implementation issue where we should
probably relax the language from MUST to MAY. I thought that we had
agreed to MAY, but MUST is in the model document.

Section 3.1.4.2 makes it clear that a server is free to use any value for the
attribute-natural-language operation attribute.

Section 3.1.6.2 says that attributes-natural-language MUST be the first
attribute returned
in each Job object whose language differs from the attributes-natural-language
in the
operation attributes.

I think WE OVERSPECIFIED THIS, especially if one or fewer text/name attributes
are being returned. It should be the option of the server to override at the
job
level or at the attribute level. This allows the server to be simple or
optimal.

Bob Herriot

At 03:23 PM 10/8/98 , Brian R Glass wrote:
>All,
>
>I find natual language in IPP somewhat confusing. Usually,
>drawing a picture helps me to clearify the issues. Do the
>following diagrams accurately describe the way natural
>language is supposed to be used in IPP?
>
>Key:
> NL = Natural Language (MOD section 3.1.4.1)
> NLO = Natural Language Override (MOD section 4.1.1.2
> 4.1.2.2)
> JNL = Job Natural Language (MOD section 3.2.6.2)
>
>
>Example 1: Both client and server are English (en)
>
> Request = get-jobs
> Client (en) Server (en)
> --------+ +--------
> | request NL=en |
> | -----------------> |
> | |
> | response NL=en |
> | <---------------- |
>
>Example 2: Client is French (fr) and server is English (en)
>
> request = get-jobs
> Client (fr) Server (en)
> --------+ +--------
> | request NL=fr |
> | -----------------> |
> | |
> | response NL=en |
> | JNL=fr |
> | <---------------- |
>
>Example 3: Client is French (fr) and server is English (en).
> In addition the client uses NLO=el (Greek) for
> requesting-user-name
>
> request = get-jobs
> Client (fr) Server (en)
> --------+ +--------
> | request NL=fr |
> | user name: NLO=el|
> | -----------------> |
> | |
> | response NL=en |
> | JNL=fr |
> | user name: NLO=el|
> | <---------------- |
>
>Note that all attributes returned are in the JNL language
>(French in this case) except the user name (job-originating-
>user-name) which is in Greek.
>
>Example 4: Client1 is French (fr) and server is English (en).
> In addition the client uses NLO=el (Greek) for
> requesting-user-name. Client2 is Greek (el).
> Client3 is German (de)
>
> request = print-job
> Client1 (fr) Server (en)
> --------+ +--------
> | request NL=fr |
> | user name: NLO=el| (job 1)
> | -----------------> |
> | |
> | response NL=en |
> | JNL=fr |
> | user name: NLO=el|
> | <---------------- |
>
> request = get-jobs
> Client2 (el) Server (en)
> --------+ +--------
> | request NL=el |
> | -----------------> |
> | |
> | response NL=en |
> | JNL=el |
> | <---------------- | (job 1)
>
> request = get-jobs
> Client3 (de) Server (en)
> --------+ +--------
> | request NL=de |
> | -----------------> |
> | |
> | response NL=en |
> | JNL=de |
> | user name: NLO=el|
> | <---------------- | (job 1)
>
>Note how client2 and client3 differ in their need for NLO.
>
>
>Example 5: Client is French (fr) and server is English (en)
>
> Request = get-printer-attributes
> Client (fr) Server (en)
> --------+ +--------
> | request NL=fr |
> | -----------------> |
> | |
> | response NL=en |
> | <---------------- |
>
>
>
>Carl stated in a previous email:
>>There is a precedence hierarchy here:
>>
>> 1. Natural Language Override
>> 2. Job object's "attributes-natural-language" value
>> 3. "attributes-natural-language" operation attribute of the response.
>>
>> 1 overrides 2 and 3, 2 overrides 3.
>
>Stated with regards to my diagrams:
> 1) all response attributes are returned in the language
> specified by the "response NL"
> 2) Number 1 above is true unless a JNL is being returned
> and then all response attributes are returned in the
> language specified by the JNL.
> 3) Number 1 and 2 above are true unless a NLO is used for
> a specific attribute.
>
>
>Does this look correct?
>
>Brian
>--
>=============================================================
>Brian R. Glass Tektronix, Inc
> 26600 SW Parkway
>Color Printing & Imaging Division PO Box 1000
> MS 60-368
>mailto:Brian.Glass@tek.com Wilsonville, OR 97070-1000
>http://www.tek.com/Color_Printers (503) 685-2456
>=============================================================
>

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Tom Hastings:  NOTE this is another implementation issue where we should
probably relax the language from MUST to MAY. I thought that we had
agreed to MAY, but MUST is in the model document.

Section 3.1.4.2 makes it clear that a server is free to use any value for the
attribute-natural-language operation attribute.

Section 3.1.6.2 says that  attributes-natural-language MUST be the first attribute returned
in each Job object whose language differs from the attributes-natural-language in the
operation attributes. 

I think WE OVERSPECIFIED THIS, especially if one or fewer text/name attributes
are being returned.  It should be the option of the server to override at the job
level or at the attribute level. This allows the server to be simple or optimal.

Bob Herriot



At 03:23 PM 10/8/98 , Brian R Glass wrote:
>All,
>
>I find natual language in IPP somewhat confusing.  Usually,
>drawing a picture helps me to clearify the issues.  Do the
>following diagrams accurately describe the way natural
>language is supposed to be used in IPP? 
>
>Key:
>        NL  = Natural Language          (MOD section 3.1.4.1)
>        NLO = Natural Language Override (MOD section 4.1.1.2
>                                         4.1.2.2)
>        JNL = Job Natural Language      (MOD section 3.2.6.2)
>
>
>Example 1: Both client and server are English (en)
>
>        Request = get-jobs
>        Client (en)                     Server (en)
>        --------+                    +--------
>                |   request NL=en    |
>                | -----------------> |
>                |                    |
>                |   response NL=en   |
>                | <----------------  |
>
>Example 2: Client is French (fr) and server is English (en)
>
>        request = get-jobs
>        Client (fr)                     Server (en)
>        --------+                    +--------
>                |   request NL=fr    |
>                | -----------------> |
>                |                    |
>                |   response NL=en   |
>                |           JNL=fr   |
>                | <----------------  |
>
>Example 3: Client is French (fr) and server is English (en). 
>           In addition the client uses NLO=el (Greek) for
>           requesting-user-name
>
>        request = get-jobs
>        Client (fr)                     Server (en)
>        --------+                    +--------
>                |   request NL=fr    |
>                |   user name: NLO=el|
>                | -----------------> |
>                |                    |
>                |   response NL=en   |
>                |           JNL=fr   |
>                |   user name: NLO=el|
>                | <----------------  |
>
>Note that all attributes returned are in the JNL language
>(French in this case) except the user name (job-originating-
>user-name) which is in Greek.
>
>Example 4: Client1 is French (fr) and server is English (en). 
>           In addition the client uses NLO=el (Greek) for
>           requesting-user-name.  Client2 is Greek (el).
>           Client3 is German (de)
>
>        request = print-job
>        Client1 (fr)                    Server (en)
>        --------+                    +--------
>                |   request NL=fr    |
>                |   user name: NLO=el|  (job 1)
>                | -----------------> |
>                |                    |
>                |   response NL=en   |
>                |           JNL=fr   |
>                |   user name: NLO=el|
>                | <----------------  |
>
>        request = get-jobs
>        Client2 (el)                    Server (en)
>        --------+                    +--------
>                |   request NL=el    |
>                | -----------------> |
>                |                    |
>                |   response NL=en   |
>                |           JNL=el   |
>                | <----------------  |  (job 1)
>
>        request = get-jobs
>        Client3 (de)                    Server (en)
>        --------+                    +--------
>                |   request NL=de    |
>                | -----------------> |
>                |                    |
>                |   response NL=en   |
>                |           JNL=de   |
>                |   user name: NLO=el|
>                | <----------------  | (job 1)
>
>Note how client2 and client3 differ in their need for NLO.
>     
>
>Example 5: Client is French (fr) and server is English (en)
>
>        Request = get-printer-attributes
>        Client (fr)                     Server (en)
>        --------+                    +--------
>                |   request NL=fr    |
>                | -----------------> |
>                |                    |
>                |   response NL=en   |
>                | <----------------  |
>
>
>
>Carl stated in a previous email:
>>There is a precedence hierarchy here:
>>
>>  1. Natural Language Override
>>  2. Job object's "attributes-natural-language" value
>>  3. "attributes-natural-language" operation attribute of the response.
>>
>> 1 overrides 2 and 3, 2 overrides 3.
>
>Stated with regards to my diagrams:            
> 1) all response attributes are returned in the language
>    specified by the "response NL"
> 2) Number 1 above is true unless a JNL is being returned
>    and then all response attributes are returned in the
>    language specified by the JNL.
> 3) Number 1 and 2 above are true unless a NLO is used for
>    a specific attribute.
>
>
>Does this look correct?
>
>Brian
>--
>=============================================================
>Brian R. Glass                                 Tektronix, Inc
>                                             26600 SW Parkway
>Color Printing & Imaging Division                 PO Box 1000
>                                                    MS 60-368
>mailto:Brian.Glass@tek.com         Wilsonville, OR 97070-1000
>http://www.tek.com/Color_Printers              (503) 685-2456
>=============================================================
>

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