Bill... I'm OK with "Systems" and I REALLY LIKE "Solutions".
Regards,
Harry
Harry Lewis
Program Manager - Intellectual Property & Open Standards
Phone: 303-924-5337
e-mail: harryl at us.ibm.com
infoprint.com
P Think before you print
"William A Wagner" <wamwagner at comcast.net>
Sent by: owner-wims at pwg.org
01/06/2009 01:11 PM
To
<wims at pwg.org>
cc
Subject
RE: WIMS> CIM> What is the W for?
Craig and Harry,
OK. You find ?semantics? too limiting and too tied in with the more
general Semantic Model activities.
But it is unlikely that we will define with management systems or
management services.
How about ?Workgroup for Imaging Management Solutions? ? That certainly is
general enough to cover anything we are likely to address and non-specific
enough so that anything we do address satisfies the term.
Comments?
Thanks,
Bill Wagner
From: owner-wims at pwg.org [mailto:owner-wims at pwg.org] On Behalf Of Whittle,
Craig
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 11:51 AM
To: Harry Lewis; William A Wagner
Cc: wims at pwg.org
Subject: RE: WIMS> CIM> What is the W for?
Bill:
I also like the broader term ?Services? or ?Systems? especially since
?Semantics? might collide with the PWG semantic model (more narrow)
activities.
Best regards,
**CW
From: owner-wims at pwg.org [mailto:owner-wims at pwg.org] On Behalf Of Harry
Lewis
Sent: Monday, January 05, 2009 9:13 PM
To: William A Wagner
Cc: wims at pwg.org
Subject: RE: WIMS> CIM> What is the W for?
Bill, thanks.
I certainly understand that WIMS is not developing a service per se, and
is not likely to, given our past. I just offer that we frequently find
ourselves looking back at the name we have chosen and prescribe a lot of
meaning, especially limitation (eg? I see no harm in keeping the original
definition of WIMS and allowing the scope and charter to over (under?)
reach the name).
So, if we changing the meaning of WIMS (which I am not opposed to), why
restrict to ?semantic? when ?service? is a broader concept to which the
semantics we are defining will ultimately apply. In my opinion, this would
allow more leeway for future reshaping w/o name consternation.
Alas? far too many words likely already spoken (typed) on the topic? so
I?m OK with either final consensus or w/g Chair conclusion. Which ever
name we choose, the same great work will ensue... I'm sure!
Harry Lewis
Program Manager - Intellectual Property & Open Standards
Phone: 303-924-5337
e-mail: harryl at us.ibm.com
infoprint.com
P Think before you print
"William A Wagner" <wamwagner at comcast.net>
01/05/2009 06:58 PM
To
Harry Lewis/US/InfoPrint/IDE at IBMUS
cc
<wims at pwg.org>
Subject
RE: WIMS> CIM> What is the W for?
Harry,
Although the original WIMS project was the development of a service
(although we never did complete the binding) , I think we got the message
that the world was not going to accept an imaging specific standard
management protocol. (?Disappointing since vendors appear convinced that
it will accept imaging manufacturer specific protocols.) In focusing on
WS-Man and then on CIM as the path to WS-Management, we recognized that
our best contribution was in identifying the imaging device/service
management elements to be used within a standard management service
(although what this service may still not be awfully clear). We also
recognized, not only that SNMP was going to be around for a while, but
that new management elements will need to be accessible via SNMP. So, on
one hand, new and updated imaging management elements must be available in
MIB form if they are to be accessible in most environments; on the other
hand, they must be compatible with the Web Services paradigm that we
expect will emerge. Indeed, Peter has said that Xerox will not support the
generation of a MIB, but presumably would support the definition of
objects characterizing the state, capabilities and configuration of some
aspect if an imaging service or device.
In the CIM effort, WIMS has been translating the appropriate management
elements defined in MIBs to CIM MOFs. In the updated charter, I suggest
that we will not only continue to do this, but go further to translate
management elements from other structures (e.g., IPP) as well as to define
new elements (power management). Having identified such elements, WIMS
must consider the bindings, if nothing else, then just to be able to
verify the validity of these elements. (As we learned with the Counter
Spec, abstract defined elements, unimplemented and unbound to a usable
transport , may have some severe problems.) So it is expected that we will
deal with MIB as well as CIM bindings, (and perhaps others). But the
essence of the work will be in identifying the elements that allow
effective management of the imaging service and devices (with probably a
stress on devices).
There is some overlap with the MFD semantics effort, largely because Ira?s
original WIMS semantics were included. But the MFD effort is largely
concerned with the semantics of the services performing their functions
rather than the monitoring, configuration and maintenance of the services
and the devices executing the services. Eventually the management
semantics that we develop may be incorporated into the overall Semantic
Model. But in the meantime, hopefully, these elements will have been
defined, bound to standard protocols , and demonstrated to provided
effective management of imaging services and devices.
Hope this makes our intent clearer,
Thanks,
Bill Wagner
From: owner-wims at pwg.org [mailto:owner-wims at pwg.org] On Behalf Of Harry
Lewis
Sent: Monday, January 05, 2009 7:27 PM
To: William A Wagner
Cc: wims at pwg.org
Subject: RE: WIMS> CIM> What is the W for?
Bill, sounds great. Only comment from me... didn't "S" used to stand for
"Services"? Will we, in the future, risk feeling now that the groups
efforts are LIMITED to semantics (whereas, semantics can always be viewed
as supporting services)?
Harry Lewis
Program Manager - Intellectual Property & Open Standards
Phone: 303-924-5337
e-mail: harryl at us.ibm.com
infoprint.com
P Think before you print
"William A Wagner" <wamwagner at comcast.net>
Sent by: owner-wims at pwg.org
01/05/2009 04:01 PM
To
<wims at pwg.org>
cc
Subject
RE: WIMS> CIM> What is the W for?
I like "Workgroup for Imaging Management Semantics". Odd that we hadn?t
thought of ?Work?? before.
Any objections?
Thanks,
Bill Wagner
From: owner-wims at pwg.org [mailto:owner-wims at pwg.org] On Behalf Of Dave
Whitehead
Sent: Monday, January 05, 2009 4:31 PM
To: Ira McDonald
Cc: Ira McDonald; Petrie, Glen; Harry Lewis; owner-wims at pwg.org;
wims at pwg.org
Subject: Re: WIMS> CIM> What is the W for?
How about "Workgroup for Imaging Management Semantics" -- that way we
don't need to explain the missing "G."
dhw
David H. Whitehead
Development Engineer
Lexmark International, Inc.
859.825.4914
davidatlexmarkdotcom
"Ira McDonald" <blueroofmusic at gmail.com>
Sent by: owner-wims at pwg.org
01/05/09 04:21 PM
To
"Harry Lewis" <harryl at us.ibm.com>, "Ira McDonald"
<blueroofmusic at gmail.com>
cc
"Petrie, Glen" <glen.petrie at eitc.epson.com>, wims at pwg.org
Subject
Re: WIMS> CIM> What is the W for?
Hi,
So, "Working Group for Imaging Management Semantics (WIMS)"
Bill is quite right that Services is not the correct scope.
A precedent is IETF PWG (Printer Working Group, originally
chartered for RFC 1179 and later for RFC 1759).
Cheers,
- Ira
Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
Blue Roof Music/High North Inc
email: blueroofmusic at gmail.com
winter:
579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176
734-944-0094
summer:
PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839
906-494-2434
On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 2:59 PM, Harry Lewis <harryl at us.ibm.com> wrote:
>> So that would be "Working group for Imaging Management Services"?
> (Semantics?) That'd be OK.
>> Also, I'd have no problem retiring both PMP and WIMS and migrating into
ISMS
> or some other agreeable new name.
>> Also, I'd have no problem just keeping WIMS as is and not getting too
> concerned that everything in the bucket is not "Web based".
>> Harry Lewis
> Program Manager - Intellectual Property & Open Standards
> Phone: 303-924-5337
> e-mail: harryl at us.ibm.com> infoprint.com
>>> P Think before you print
>>> "Petrie, Glen" <glen.petrie at eitc.epson.com>
> Sent by: owner-wims at pwg.org>> 01/05/2009 12:21 PM
>> To
> <wims at pwg.org>
> cc
> Subject
> RE: WIMS> CIM> What is the W for?
>>>>> I support W as "Working group"
>> ________________________________
> From: owner-wims at pwg.org [mailto:owner-wims at pwg.org] On Behalf Of
>Richard_Landau at Dell.com> Sent: Monday, January 05, 2009 11:10 AM
> To: wims at pwg.org> Subject: WIMS> CIM> What is the W for?
>>> Re: changing the name of the WIMS group to reflect its broader scope
>> If the goal is to retain the acronym WIMS, we must construct a suitable
> backronym. The problem is the W, since the absorbed PMP items are not
> "Web-based." The current charter draft suggests "Wide-scope."
>> A few minutes with a dictionary yielded some other possibilities.
>> Interesting but rejected:
> - Wagner's (practical)
> - Wonderful (boastful)
> - Whiz-bang (flippant)
>> Possible:
> - Well-known
> - Working group for, as in "Working group for Imaging Management
Semantics."
>> So long as the W does not stand for Washington, or for any other meaning
of
> "W" recently related to Washington, it's okay.
>> Of course, we could always change the name slightly, since lots of
> interesting words end in MS for Management Semantics. For example,
Imaging
> Systems Management Semantics, or ISMS. Has kind of a nice ring to it.
>> rick
>> ----------------------
> Richard_Landau(at)dell(dot)com, Stds & System Mgt Architecture, CTO
Office
> +1-512-728-9023, One Dell Way, RR5-3, MS RR5-32, Round Rock, TX 78682