Ira,
I provided my observations for information only. But this brings up the significant question of at what point do we sacrifice too much of the managability capability to deal with the cumbersomeness of the CIM route. And a related question of whether there is sufficient concern in the industry of how this effort, which is conceived as the basis for Web Services management, comes out to either help in the effort or put some pressure on DMTF. Four votes our of 2xx from DMTF does not indicate any interest there.
Bill Wagner
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "McDonald, Ira" <imcdonald at sharplabs.com>
Hi Bill,
My point is that this status property, when added to our CIM_Printer
(from prtGeneralEntry), will probably generate a lot of discussion
and pushback from CIM Core, but what-the-heck, we can spare a
decade to model Print Device, right?
And Rick's suggesting that we'll probably have to move this boolean
out to a new (otherwise empty) class CIM_PrintConsole that contains
the state property and accepts two methods (enable and disable).
Cheers,
- Ira
Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839
phone: +1-906-494-2434
email: imcdonald at sharplabs.com
-----Original Message-----
From: wamwagner at comcast.net [mailto:wamwagner at comcast.net]
Sent: Monday, April 23, 2007 3:49 PM
To: Richard_Landau at Dell.com; McDonald, Ira; wims at pwg.org
Subject: RE: WIMS> CIM> There is one podssible candidate for EnabledLogicalElement
Some general comments.
1. I am aware of printers that support write for both prtGeneralReset and prtConsoleDisable. Granted that these are dangerous from a security viewpoint, there are many MIB writeable objects that are so. SNMP security must be provided by SNMPv3, shutting off SNMP (or just SNMP write) or by other methods.
2. I thought that we had agreed that CIM printing MOFs would be read only, with CIM operations handling the write functionality.
Bill Wagner
-------------- Original message --------------
From: <Richard_Landau at Dell.com>
Subject still ConsoleDisable.
BTW, I know that the DEC PostScript/SNMP printers of my generation, that is, until early 2000, did implement this feature. Don't know if customers used it. But that is not the point.
Believe it or not, the equivalent of ConsoleDisable for desktop monitors is among the most-requested features from large businesses these days. They call it ConsoleLock, but it's the same thing: don't let the user futz with the buttons. Yes, it does require that one re-enable the console for a service call, but apparently it also makes service calls less frequent. Go figure.
In any case, if there is a secure method to invoke this, it is a useful and desirable feature, and I think we should carry it forward in future standards.
rick
From: McDonald, Ira [mailto:imcdonald at sharplabs.com]
Sent: Friday, April 20, 2007 12:25
To: Landau, Richard; wims at pwg.org
Subject: RE: WIMS> CIM> There is one podssible candidate for EnabledLogicalElement
Hi Rick,
Well, hypothetical capability today in Printer MIB... The conformance
macro allows 'read-only'. And I have personally never encountered
a printer that allows remote disable of the console (think about this - it
breaks service scenarios entirely). This is an edge condition.
Now, remote reset of the printer actually does make sense (via a CIM
operation of course). Although, again I don't think there are current
printers that allow remote reset via SNMP (for security reasons).
Cheers,
- Ira
Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839
phone: +1-906-494-2434
email: imcdonald at sharplabs.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Richard_Landau at Dell.com [mailto:Richard_Landau at Dell.com]
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 4:08 PM
To: McDonald, Ira; wims at pwg.org
Subject: RE: WIMS> CIM> There is one podssible candidate for EnabledLogicalElement
I was not proposing any analogous property at all, but an empty class with only the method to change the state. What I intend is having a class to represent the function of the property we don't like. And the class has a RequestStateChange() method to effect the function. And the enabled-disabled state of the class shows up in the existing EnabledState property.
This is the *last* thing I would do to the new model, after adding all the other stuff as read-only as we agreed. Or rather, the first thing of the new writable model, the pipe cleaner for putting write functions on various properties.
We have the capability (pardon the expression) today, at least in the model if not in many implementations, to disable console input. If we can model the capability in another way that does not expose a dangerous writable property, that seems like a good thing.
rick
From: McDonald, Ira [mailto:imcdonald at sharplabs.com]
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 15:39
To: Landau, Richard; wims at pwg.org
Subject: RE: WIMS> CIM> There is one podssible candidate for EnabledLogicalElement
Hi,
My two cents - NO - no writable properties at all - no state changing methods
defined in any Phase 2 modelling activity - drop this property entirely or show
it as a read-only boolean in CIM_Printer.
Cheers,
- Ira
Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
Blue Roof Music / High North Inc
PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839
phone: +1-906-494-2434
email: imcdonald at sharplabs.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-wims at pwg.org [mailto:owner-wims at pwg.org]On Behalf Of Richard_Landau at Dell.com
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 1:51 PM
To: Richard_Landau at Dell.com; wims at pwg.org
Subject: RE: WIMS> CIM> There is one podssible candidate for EnabledLogicalElement
Actually, I would propose calling the class ConsoleButtons or ConsoleInput. The existing function does not disable the lights or text display, only input from the buttons.
rick
From: owner-wims at pwg.org [mailto:owner-wims at pwg.org] On Behalf Of Richard_Landau at Dell.com
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 13:42
To: wims at pwg.org
Subject: WIMS> CIM> There is one possible candidate for EnabledLogicalElement
Console. Not ConsoleLights or ConsoleDisplayBuffer, but a class with no properties other than state so that it can be enabled and disabled. In the voting spreadsheet from eons ago, we all voted prtGeneralConsoleDisable as priority A. And there is a comment on it that says, "must be implemented as CIM state accessible by RequestStateChange() method." Who would have guessed that we had such foresight way back then.
Proposal: When we get to it, we can use this as a pipe cleaner for CIM modeling of this writable property. I think it results in an otherwise empty class derived directly from EnabledLogicalElement. No new properties, just the state properties and RequestStateChange() method inherited from the parent.
Comments?
rick
----------------------
Richard_Landau(at)dell(dot)com, Stds & System Mgt Architecture, CTO Office
+1-512-728-9023, One Dell Way, RR5-3, MS RR5-09, Round Rock, TX 78682
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