Don,
I'm still waiting to know whether or not to edit the 10 IPP I-Ds that
recommend that readers join the ipp DL, but don't say you have to join in
order to send questions or comments to the DL. I've be glad to update the
language, while I'm editing all 10 I-Ds for other reasons.
The current text in all 10 IPP I-Ds says:
IPP Web Page: http://www.pwg.org/ipp/
IPP Mailing List: ipp at pwg.org
To subscribe to the ipp mailing list, send the following email:
1) send it to majordomo at pwg.org
2) leave the subject line blank
3) put the following two lines in the message body:
subscribe ipp
end
Implementers of this specification document are encouraged to join IPP
Mailing List in order to participate in any discussions of clarification
issues and review of registration proposals for additional attributes and
values.
Question: When majordomo is configured to reject mail from non-subscribers,
does it send back a reply to the sender? If so, then that reply could
indicate that the sender must subscribe to the mailing list. Whether or not
the mail message contains the instructions to subscribe is a question, but
would be user-friendly. I've been told that majordomo is good at being
configurable, so it may have a way to add a custom message to the rejection.
However, if majordomo just silently eats the mail message without an
indication to the user that his mail has not been delivered to the rest of
the DL, then we should update the notice in our IPP I-Ds.
We could add the sentence:
In order to reduce spam the mailing list may reject mail from
non-subscribers, so you may have to subscribe to the mailing list in order
to send a question or comment to the mailing list.
Should I add such a sentence? Then we can change the way our mailing list
works in the future, if we are still undecided.
Or if we are definitely going to make the change, the sentence could be:
In order to reduce spam the mailing list rejects mail from non-subscribers,
so you must subscribe to the mailing list in order to send a question or
comment to the mailing list.
Tom
-----Original Message-----
From: don at lexmark.com [mailto:don at lexmark.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2001 05:07
To: Hastings, Tom N
Subject: RE: PWG-ANNOUNCE> Changes coming to the PWG mailing lists
Tom:
Spammers find out about mailing list often by automated robots scanning
through
web pages looking for anything in the form of whomever at whereever.whatever.
As
long as any web page (including our own) has the mailing lists listed,
spammers
will find them. Spammers to not have the human resources available to do
the
work of asking majordomo machines what lists are running there. It is 100%
automated scanning of web sites.
**********************************************
* Don Wright don at lexmark.com *
* Chair, Printer Working Group *
* Chair, IEEE MSC *
* *
* Director, Alliances & Standards *
* Lexmark International *
* 740 New Circle Rd *
* Lexington, Ky 40550 *
* 859-825-4808 (phone) 603-963-8352 (fax) *
**********************************************
"Hastings, Tom N" <hastings%cp10.es.xerox.com at interlock.lexmark.com> on
07/02/2001 05:45:59 PM
To: "Don_Wright/Lex/Lexmark.LEXMARK"@sweeper.lex.lexmark.com
cc: "Hastings, Tom N" <hastings%cp10.es.xerox.com at interlock.lexmark.com>,
"Carl-Uno Manros (E-mail)"
<cmanros%cp10.es.xerox.com at interlock.lexmark.com>, "Bob Herriot
(E-mail)"
<rherriot%pahv.xerox.com at interlock.lexmark.com> (bcc: Don
Wright/Lex/Lexmark)
Subject: RE: PWG-ANNOUNCE> Changes coming to the PWG mailing lists
Don,
I'm hopeful that we can still find a way to limit the spam without
eliminating legitimate questions about our work being sent by
non-subscribers to our DLs.
Do you know how the spammers find out about our PWG DLs? I see that the
majordomo lists command still works (see below). Is that how the spammers
find out about our DLs?
What if majordomo was disabled for the lists command, unless you are on some
particular DL, such as the pwg DL? Would that stop the spammers from
finding out about our DLs?
Thanks,
Tom
-----Original Message-----
From: Majordomo at pwg.org [mailto:Majordomo at pwg.org]
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2001 14:02
To: hastings at cp10.es.xerox.com
Subject: Majordomo results
--
>>>> lists
Majordomo serves the following lists:
abuse
fin PWG Printer Finisher MIB project (FIN)
ifx
ipp PWG Internet Printing Protocol project (IPP)
jmp PWG Job Monitoring MIB project (JMP)
mfd
p1394 PWG Firewire (IEEE 1394) Project
pmp PWG Printer MIB project (PMP)
pwg Printer Working Group (PWG)
pwg-announce Printer Working Group (PWG) Announcements
pwg-ipp
removal
sdp Server-to-Device Printing Protocol (SDP)
sense Simple Event Notification Service Environment
(SENSE)
upd Universal Print Driver (UPD)
xp
Use the 'info <list>' command to get more information
about a specific list.
>>>> end
END OF COMMANDS
-----Original Message-----
From: don at lexmark.com [mailto:don at lexmark.com]
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2001 11:59
To: Hastings, Tom N
Subject: RE: PWG-ANNOUNCE> Changes coming to the PWG mailing lists
Can't do this with majrodomo as far as I can tell.
**********************************************
* Don Wright don at lexmark.com *
* Chair, Printer Working Group *
* Chair, IEEE MSC *
* *
* Director, Alliances & Standards *
* Lexmark International *
* 740 New Circle Rd *
* Lexington, Ky 40550 *
* 859-825-4808 (phone) 603-963-8352 (fax) *
**********************************************
"Hastings, Tom N" <hastings%cp10.es.xerox.com at interlock.lexmark.com> on
06/18/2001 04:00:46 PM
To: "'don at lexmark.com'"
<"Don_Wright/Lex/Lexmark.LEXMARK"@sweeper.lex.lexmark.com>
cc: "Herriot, Robert"
<Robert.Herriot%pahv.xerox.com at interlock.lexmark.com>,
"Manros, Carl-Uno B"
<cmanros%cp10.es.xerox.com at interlock.lexmark.com>,
"Hastings, Tom N" <hastings%cp10.es.xerox.com at interlock.lexmark.com>
(bcc:
Don Wright/Lex/Lexmark)
Subject: RE: PWG-ANNOUNCE> Changes coming to the PWG mailing lists
Don,
Another scenario is when someone from the DL sends a question to someone not
on the DL, but copies the DL in order to engage that non-DL person in a
dialog with the DL. It would be nice if the reply (reply ALL) by that
someone which copies the DL would be send to the DL? If your modifications
to majordomo can't recognize such a reply, then we'll need to educate those
of us that are sending mail to non-DL subscribers and CCing the DL, to
remember to forward the response to the DL.
Thanks,
Tom
-----Original Message-----
From: Hastings, Tom N
Sent: Monday, June 18, 2001 12:49
To: don at lexmark.com
Cc: Tom Hastings (E-mail); Bob Herriot (E-mail); Carl-Uno Manros
(E-mail)
Subject: RE: PWG-ANNOUNCE> Changes coming to the PWG mailing lists
Don,
Sounds like a change we have to live with in order to reduce the spam.
One question. Occasionally, we get someone sending a mail note to our DL
with a real question for the DL. Will they get a reply rejecting their
email message? What will the message say? Could the reject mail message
suggest that they send the question to one of the authors of the related
document and/or join the appropriate email mailing list?
Do spammers look at replies? If they do, then we shouldn't include the
email address of the authors in the rejection reply message.
Thanks,
Tom
-----Original Message-----
From: don at lexmark.com [mailto:don at lexmark.com]
Sent: Friday, June 15, 2001 09:46
To: pwg-announce at pwg.org
Subject: PWG-ANNOUNCE> Changes coming to the PWG mailing lists
In order to reduce the spam level on the PWG mailing lists, we intend to
change
Majordomo to only accept e-mail for the mailing list from e-mail addresses
that
are on that mailing list. I expect this to happen in the next week or so.
Therefore, if you have multiple e-mail accounts or aliased e-mail accounts
which
are not subscribed to a mailing list, you will no longer have the ability to
mail from those accounts.
Sorry to have to do this but with the ever rising spam level it is really
our
only choice.
**********************************************
* Don Wright don at lexmark.com *
* Chair, Printer Working Group *
* Chair, IEEE MSC *
* *
* Director, Alliances & Standards *
* Lexmark International *
* 740 New Circle Rd *
* Lexington, Ky 40550 *
* 859-825-4808 (phone) 603-963-8352 (fax) *
**********************************************