attachment-0002
Hi Glen,<br><br>I see the logic of your comments.<br><br>But IPP/2.0 Second Edition *did* specifically resolve this<br>"quality" versus "resolution" question based on quite a lot<br>of mailing list and face-to-face discussion. This is stated<br>
in on page 21, section 6.2, item 8 of PWG 5100.12.<br><br>So a conforming IPP Printer has to behave accordingly.<br><br>We can add more discussion in IPP JPS3, if that seems<br>appropriate, but we really can't reverse the IPP/2.0 SE, <br>
because that would not be backward compatible.<br><br>Cheers,<br>- Ira<br><br clear="all">Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)<br>Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG<br>Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group<br>
Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG IPP WG<br>Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG<br>Chair - TCG Embedded Systems Hardcopy SG<br>IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB<br>Blue Roof Music/High North Inc<br><a style="color:rgb(51,51,255)" href="http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic" target="_blank">http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic</a><br>
<a style="color:rgb(102,0,204)" href="http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc" target="_blank">http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc</a><br>mailto:<a href="mailto:blueroofmusic@gmail.com" target="_blank">blueroofmusic@gmail.com</a><br>
Winter 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094<br>Summer PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434<div style="display:inline"></div><div style="display:inline"></div><div style="display:inline"></div><div>
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<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Feb 2, 2012 at 10:06 AM, Petrie, Glen <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:glen.petrie@eitc.epson.com">glen.petrie@eitc.epson.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue">Mike,<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue">Interesting but I still believe my
conclusions support both a simple and sophisticated user-centric model. A
simple user-centric model will always use the “quality” setting and,
for added “control”, will set “content type” to get the
desired output. Sophisticated users will want to control the finer
details and, thus, may want a specific resolution. <u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue">As to “draft” operations or any
other quality setting operations: in general, no print vendor is going to
use simpler/faster dithers or color-transform or not perform print row
interleaving, if it reduces the overall printed quality of the output simply
because the user set quality setting to draft/normal/high in a Print Client.
There would be insignificant amount of processing required; no need to support
multiple dither/color transforms routines; and an unnoticeable amount of additional
(if any) overall print time. If a user specifies a resolution
versus quality; then, saving ink was not his/her intent; he/she wants a specific
resolution for his/her specific reason. While bi-directional versus
uni-directional printing are affected by quality settings; print service internal
selection (not user set) would also use content-type (for example; high-quality
text (bi) versus high-quality photo(uni)) which, of course, bi versus uni, can
also be done as a function of resolution and the content-type.<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue">The constraint is solved by;<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<li class="MsoNormal" style="color:blue"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria">The
content-type MUST be set; <u></u><u></u></span></font></li>
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<li class="MsoNormal" style="color:blue"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria">The
default could be “text and graphic”<u></u><u></u></span></font></li>
</ol>
<li class="MsoNormal" style="color:blue"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria">If
user sets resolution; then the Print Services uses this resolution along
with content-type. The Print Service will ignore any quality-setting
and set any internal processing based on resolution and content-type only.
<u></u><u></u></span></font></li>
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<li class="MsoNormal" style="color:blue"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria">If
the resolution set is not supported; then return an error. (How
this could occur from a print client that received printer capability
data is unknown but just in-case the user is allowed to “type”
in any resolution they want!) <u></u><u></u></span></font></li>
</ol>
<li class="MsoNormal" style="color:blue"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria">If
user set quality but not resolution, then<u></u><u></u></span></font></li>
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<li class="MsoNormal" style="color:blue"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria">The
Print Service uses content-type and quality-setting to determine a
resolution and internal processing.<u></u><u></u></span></font></li>
</ol>
</ol>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue">IMHO, the user must always be in
control. Setting resolution is more specific than setting quality, since
quality is qualitative versus quantitative; thus, if a user sets a resolution;
then that what should be done. <u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue">I think we will have to agree to
disagree and simply move on!<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue">glen<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><font face="Tahoma"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold">From:</span></font></b><font face="Tahoma"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma"> Michael Sweet
[mailto:<a href="mailto:msweet@apple.com" target="_blank">msweet@apple.com</a>] <br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Sent:</span></b> Wednesday, February 01, 2012
5:00 PM</span></font></p><div class="im"><font face="Tahoma"><br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">To:</span></b> Petrie, Glen<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Cc:</span></b> <a href="mailto:mfd@pwg.org" target="_blank">mfd@pwg.org</a><br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: [MFD] Question on
Resolution Versus Qaulity</font></div><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><u></u><u></u></font></span><p></p><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888">
</font></span></div><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888">
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">Glen,<u></u><u></u></span></font></p></font></span><div><div class="h5">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">On Feb 1, 2012, at 3:45 PM, Petrie, Glen wrote:<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">Conceptually there is no reason a printer could not support a draft
mode for multiple resolutions (and this is in fact the case in CUPS/Mac OS X),
so preventing both from being specified will do a disservice to the user and
printer/driver.<u></u><u></u><u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:blue"><u></u> <u></u></span></font><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue">[gwp] So if we have “draft”
at 75, 150, 300; and the user can select both “draft” and 300; then
what is the value of “draft” to the Print Service since the Print
Service was told to print at 300 dpi.</span></font><u></u><u></u></p>
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</span></blockquote>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">"Draft" might select (for example) bidirectional printing on
an inkjet with no interleaving of dot rows. It could also use a simpler/faster
dithering algorithm, simpler/faster color transform, use less inks (i.e.
just CMYK instead of CMYKcmk), etc.<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt" type="cite"><span style="text-align:-webkit-auto;word-spacing:0px">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue">[gwp] Users are more likely to select
“quality” equals “draft” and “contentOptimize”
equals “photo” and not a dpi (ops: resolution). If a
user ‘really understands’ the Print Service performance for
differing dpi’s (again ops: resolution’s); then
“quality” should never win because the user knows exactly what dpi
they want!</span></font><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">Users do not know how quality and resolution interact, and in the
absence of the JPS3 mechanisms for doing constraint resolution there is no way
for the client to know either.<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue"> </span></font></span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt" type="cite"><span style="text-align:-webkit-auto;word-spacing:0px">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">Quality != Resolution. They may be related, and there may in fact
be constraints that cause a particular combination to conflict, but they are
not mutually exclusive and express separate intent. The IPP/2.0
recommendation to prefer Quality over Resolution when there is a conflict is a
pragmatic approach to automatic conflict resolution.<u></u><u></u><u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue"><u></u> <u></u></span></font><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue">[gwp] Print-Resolution is a function of
both Quality AND Content-Optimize. Any printer today can determine
a resolution from these two values. If a user specifies a resolution then
the Print Service should use the resolution (resolution is always the winner)
since the user is stating they want the specified resolution that gives them a
desired quality for the content!</span></font><u></u><u></u></p>
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</div>
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</span></blockquote>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">and if that resolution is supported by the printer then by all means it
should use it! But if not, the printer should let the client know it can't use
that resolution and use the closest resolution instead...<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><br>
<br>
<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue">[gwp]
The conclusion is then</span></font></span><span><font size="4"><span style="font-size:13.5pt"><u></u><u></u></span></font></span></p>
<span style="text-align:-webkit-auto;word-spacing:0px"><u></u><u></u><u></u>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria;color:blue"> <u></u></span></font><u></u><u></u></p>
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<li class="MsoNormal" style="color:blue"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria">Specified
Resolution wins over “Quality” - always, since the User
specified ‘use this resolution”.</span></font><u></u><u></u></li>
</ol>
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</span>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">The user specified "use this quality". One has to win, and
IMHO (and based on what we agreed to and approved in IPP/2.0 SE) Quality wins
over Resolution.<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt" type="cite"><span style="text-align:-webkit-auto;word-spacing:0px"><u></u><u></u>
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<li class="MsoNormal" style="color:blue"><font color="blue" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></li>
<li class="MsoNormal" style="color:blue"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria">Content-Optimize
MUST be required – for a printer to properly determine the correct
resolution when resolution is not specified.</span></font><u></u><u></u></li>
</ol>
</div>
</div>
</span></blockquote>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">That's what defaults are for...<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><br>
<br>
<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
<span style="text-align:-webkit-auto;word-spacing:0px"><u></u><u></u>
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<li class="MsoNormal" style="color:blue"><font color="blue" face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></li>
<li class="MsoNormal" style="color:blue"><font color="blue" face="Cambria" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Cambria">Print-Quality
is [Quality (-Intent) + Content-Optimize ] or [ Resolution] but not both.<u></u><u></u></span></font><u></u><u></u></li>
</ol>
</div>
</div>
</span>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt">Again, these elements are related but not mutually exclusive.<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
<div><span style="text-align:-webkit-auto;word-spacing:0px"><span style="text-align:-webkit-auto;word-spacing:0px">
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">
<p class="MsoNormal"><font color="black" face="Andale Mono" size="4"><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Andale Mono"">_________________________________________________________<br>
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair<u></u><u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
</span></span></div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size:12.0pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></font></p>
</div>
</div></div></div><div><div class="h5">
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