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<div dir="ltr"><div><div><div><div><div><div>Hi Mike,<br><br></div>Right - Of course there is no job template attribute for "pdl-override".<br><br></div>There is an "overrides (1setOf collection)" attribute with the specific<br>
</div>job processing instructions to use for forced override.<br><br></div>So my idea is that Validate-Job should tell you *which* of the "overrides" <br>values will be honored (with "ipp-attribute-fidelity" of 'true'). Why isn't<br>
this useful?<br><br></div><div>Cheers,<br></div><div>- Ira<br><br></div></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all"><div><div dir="ltr">Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)<br>Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG<br>
Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG<br>Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group<br>Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG<br>IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB<br>Blue Roof Music / High North Inc<br>
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mailto: <a href="mailto:blueroofmusic@gmail.com" target="_blank">blueroofmusic@gmail.com</a><br>Winter 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094<br>Summer PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434<br><br><div style="display:inline">
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<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Jun 2, 2014 at 11:29 AM, Michael Sweet <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:msweet@apple.com" target="_blank">msweet@apple.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">Ira,<div><br><div><div class=""><div>On Jun 2, 2014, at 11:00 AM, Ira McDonald <<a href="mailto:blueroofmusic@gmail.com" target="_blank">blueroofmusic@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div></div>
<blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr"><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div>Hi Mike,<br><br></div><div class="">What I was trying to "fix" is that "pdl-override" of 'guaranteed' is largely<br>
</div></div><div class="">useless, because the degree of override supported in a given PDL<br>
</div></div>interpreter varies.<br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>I think you mean 'attempted' here:</div><div><br></div>pdl-override-supported='guaranteed' means that the IPP Printer will guarantee it can override any PDL instructions with the IPP job ticket. A Printer only reports this if it can do so, and I would expect printers to be able to do this for JPEG, PDF, and PWG Raster at a minimum.</div>
<div><br></div><div>pdl-override-supported='attempted' means that the IPP Printer will attempt to override any PDL instructions with the IPP job ticket. It could see some printers report this for PWG Raster since they might not be able to rescale raster data for different media.</div>
<div><br></div><div><div>pdl-override-supported='not-attempted' means that the IPP Printer will not override any PDL instructions with the IPP job ticket. This is by far the most commonly reported value for PCL and PostScript printers.</div>
<div class=""><div><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr"><div><div><div><div><div><div>So the IPP Client (sending document data that it did NOT generate but<br></div>that MAY contain job processing instructions) could use 'attempted' to<br>
</div>learn what is ?safe? to try to override.<br></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div></div>The Client will never use 'attempted'. That is a Printer capability that the Client can discover via Get-Printer-Attributes. There is no "pdl-override" Job Template attribute.</div>
<div><br></div><div>A Client can specify ipp-attribute-fidelity='true' or job-mandatory-attributes, and can expect either an outright error at submission time (Printer sees a Job Template attribute it cannot override and doesn't even try) or an error during processing leading to an aborted job (Printer sees something it can't override and reports the error). And for a non-conforming Printer the job might even print without errors.</div>
<div><div class=""><br><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr"><div><div><div>If this problem isn't worth "fixing", then I suggest that "pdl-override" with<br>*any* value is not a useful IPP feature - and the Implementor's Guide <br>
</div>should warn IPP Client developers to avoid using it accordingly.<br></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div></div>Again, "pdl-override" is not a Job Template attribute. It doesn't exist.</div><div>
<br></div><div>The guidance here should be to prefer JPEG, PDF, PWG Raster, and other well-defined file formats over legacy formats like PCL and PostScript, specifically because overrides are better supported and output is more consistent. And in the same place we can offer a warning/note about legacy PDLs - they are printer specific and often need the output intent embedded in them vs. as IPP Job Template attributes.</div>
<div><br></div><div>We should probably also provide guidance to Printer implementations (and I think we already have this) on what value(s) to report for "pdl-override-supported" and how to deal with attributes that cannot be overridden.</div>
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<span style="border-collapse:separate;font-family:'Andale Mono';border-spacing:0px"><span style="border-collapse:separate;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:'Andale Mono';font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-align:-webkit-auto;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><div style="word-wrap:break-word">
_________________________________________________________<br>Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair</div></span></span>
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