attachment

Bill, Given the recent discussions and new information involving this project, it is important to pause and make sure our original assumptions and direction are still valid. In particular, I had assumed that Windows provides a full WS-Management application. As a result, I agreed that the PWG should develop a MIB-to-CIM provider so that this full WS-Management application could manage CIM printers, since no SNMP path was available. It seems this assumption is not valid for Windows, in that Windows SMS2003 and perhaps the follow-on SystemConfigurationresourceManager ( I am still investigating this) do not provide support for WS-Management for printers (Note: it supports WS-Management for Windows Hardware Platform, Mobile Devices).  If Windows does not have such a WS-Management application, and we want printers being able "<tt>to be managed along with other network devices by some extant general Web Services management capability</tt> ", then Oki Data's position is not to provide CIM printer object at all, but rather implement the PWG MFD semantic model's web services binding for future full featured WS-Management applications including printers. As a confirmation, we should ask Microsoft about their roadmap for SMS + WS-Management + printers including the target ship date. General WS-Management applications can take XML-schema, which can be provided by any printer that implements PWG Print Service model in XML-schema (a WSD-Printer for example).  CIM conversion was assumed to be a quick path into full Microsoft WS-Management applications, since a conversion module exisits (WinRM). However,  as Rick pointed out, WinRM only provides a command line interface, not good enough as a full-featured GUI-based printer management application using WS-Management.  Since there is no full-blown application (just command line browser feature), the benefit of doing the CIM conversion is not clear, and requires further discussion.   I believe many printer/device management applications such as WebJetAdmin, Tivoli, CA, etc., are all migrating toward WS-Management of web services. Some of these accept CIM objects, but the printer management programs like webJetAdmin do not. Therefore, the printer management specific programs will likely migrate directly from SNMP to WS-Management while maintaining SNMP backwards compatibility. There is no benefit, but rather extra overhead, in going through a CIM converter. Do these application takes CIM objects only? It is important to ensure the PWG MFD semantic model support the full capabilities such as power management, and then let printer vendors migrate their programs to WS-Management utilizing the MFD spec. If Microsoft and others can be expected to provide full WS-Management applications in the next 2-3 years, then perhaps we should redirect the effort towards creating an SNMP -> MFD WS-Services Listening Agent so that legacy printers can work with the full IT environment WS-Management applications, and so that all printer vendors can support legacy devices in their WS-Printer Management applications. -Nancy ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Principal Engineer Solutions and Technology Oki Data 2000 Bishops Gate Blvd. Mt. Laurel, NJ 08054 Phone: (856)222-7006 Email: nchen@okidata.com <table width=100%> <tr valign=top> <td width=40%>"William A Wagner" <wamwagner@comcast.net> Sent by: owner-wims@pwg.org 07/10/2008 04:11 PM <td width=59%> <table width=100%> <tr valign=top> <td> <div align=right>To</div> <td><wims@pwg.org> <tr valign=top> <td> <div align=right>cc</div> <td> <tr valign=top> <td> <div align=right>Subject</div> <td>WIMS> Concall- 14 July 11AM  NOTE PHONE CHANGE!</table> <table> <tr valign=top> <td> <td></table> </table> <tt>NOTE CALL-IN CHANGE </tt> <tt>The next WIMS/CIM concall is at 11 AM EDT Monday, 14 July. </tt> <tt>The dial-in information is: Call-in toll-free number (US/Canada):  1-866-469-3239 Call-in toll number (US/Canada):  1-650-429-3300 Call-in toll number (US/Canada):  1-408-856-9570 Attendee access code:   21967831 </tt> <tt>Don't worry about attendee ID code. </tt> <tt>The agenda is much like last weeks. But Item 4 should be considered in the light of the information from Nancy and Rick that boils down to that fact that a CIM provider deriving its device information by SNMP access to the printer, even when used in conjunction with existing Windows facilities, will NOT:</tt> <tt>A. allow printers to be managed along with other network devices by some extant general Web Services management capability</tt> <tt>B. Provide anything but a low-level command line user management application, roughly equivalent to a simple SNMP browser. </tt> <tt>We need to come up with some conceptual diagrams: </tt> <tt>SNMP                         CIM             WS-MAN (?) Printer <-------->CIM provider proxy <--------->COMOM<------------> WIN-RM</tt> <tt>(or higher level management application) </tt> <tt>Proposed Agenda: </tt> <tt>1. Review of 7 July minutes: ftp://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/wims/minutes/cim-wims_080707.pdf and ftp://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/wims/minutes/cim-wims_080707.doc </tt> <tt>2. Counter MIB CIM conversions. Ira posed several questions for which no answers are listed (ftp://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/wims/cim/mofinput/ira-20080615.zip).</tt> <tt>a. Mapping String length b. Config Change Element c. Timestamp</tt> <tt>3. Update on Dell Prototyping Activity </tt> <tt>4. MIB-CIM Provider Effort a. Ideas on development sponsor...Company that would benefit sufficiently</tt> <tt>to sponsor development b. Member Companies willing to contribute funds, manpower for Open</tt> <tt>Printing effort c. What do we really want as a result of development?</tt> <tt>1. second implementation of Printer Schema to get out of experimental status (Yes)</tt> <tt>2. Freely available, product level release of Provider application a. Who  provides executables for which OS? b. Who makes availability known, distributes c. Who maintains software, does customer service</tt> <tt>3. Open source code to be used by Imaging Equipment manufacturers of others to produce (proprietary) applications? 5. Next steps. </tt> <tt>Thanks. Hope you can join the call. </tt> <tt>Bill Wagner </tt>