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<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=us-ascii"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;">Bill,<div><br></div><div>Sorry, finally getting a chance to read through this and respond...</div><div><br><div><div>On Feb 24, 2013, at 4:50 PM, William A Wagner <<a href="mailto:wamwagner@comcast.net">wamwagner@comcast.net</a>> wrote:</div><blockquote type="cite"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;"><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif;">In pursuing the question about  the SM correlation to Get-Printer-Suppported-Values in table 1, Operations for IPP FaxOut, there appear to be several inconsistencies.<o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><span>1.<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';">   <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span>ValidateFaxOutJob  does not exist. ValidateFaxOutJobTicket is probably intended.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>Correct.</div><div><br></div><div><blockquote type="cite"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;"><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><span>2.<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';">   <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span>I find no RestartFaxOutJob in either the SM FaxOut Service or general SM Model. Does the make sense? There is a ResubmitFaxOutJob.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>I believe IPP's Restart-Job was never brought into the Semantic Model because of the accounting issues is causes.  I can ban its use in FaxOut, much like we've banned Print-Job and Print-URI, if people prefer...</div><div><br></div><div><blockquote type="cite"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;"><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><span>3.<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';">   <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span> The SM FaxOut Service does not appear to differentiate GetFaxOutJobElements from the general Get<service>JobElements, which has an important difference from IPP Get-Job-Attributes.  Unlike the IPP Get-Job-Attributes, the GetFaxOutJobElements request does not specify individual Elements. Rather, the Client requests specific groups of Elements contained within the Job. The allowed values for RequestedElements are Job Receipt, Job Status, or Job Ticket. It is not clearly stated whether the FaxOut follows the Common Semantics (presumably it must) or the IPP printer approach.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>I believe this is an artifact of the web services binding; IPP has attribute groups that can be requested (job-template, job-description, etc.) as well as individual named attributes, so I don't think this is an issue.</div><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;"><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><span>4.<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';">   <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span>The SM FaxOut Service does not appear to differentiate GetFaxOutServiceElements from the general Get<service>ServiceElements, which has an important difference from IPP Get-Printer-Attributes. Unlike the IPP Get-Printer-Attributes, the GetFaxOutServiceElements request does not specify individual Elements. Rather, the Client requests specific groups of Elements contained within the Job. The allowed values for Requested Elements are Service Capabilities, Service Configuration, Service Description, Service Status or DefaultJob Ticket. This distinction is not clearly stated.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>Same comment as for #3.</div><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;"><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><span>5.<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';">   <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span>As follows from item 4, the correlation to  SM Get-Printer-Supported-Values is GetFaxOutServiceElements with values of Service Configuration, Service Description and Service Status (??)</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>No, there is a semantic difference.  Get-Printer-Supported-Values returns the original manufacturer xxx-supported values while Get-Printer-Attributes returns the values as configured by the administrator of the printer - a configuration utility would use Get-Printer-Supported-Values to get the full set of values that can be configured and Get-Printer-Attributes to get the currently configured values.</div><div><br></div><div>What we'd need is (effectively) a <service>DefaultConfiguration group in the Semantic Model to provide the same information.</div><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;"><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><span>6.<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';">   <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span>Comment: - should the SM address subscriptions?</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>I think we need to for Cloud, at least.</div><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;"><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><span>7.<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';">   <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span>ReleaseHeldNewFaxOutJobs does not exist. ReleaseHeldFaxOutJobs ( no 'new') is probably intended.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>Correct.</div><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;"><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><span>8.<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';">   <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span>Deactivate and Activate were dropped from the SM model. Do we really need these?</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>They are part of IPP already.  </div><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;"><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><span>9.<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';">   <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span>It might be noted that Startup-Printer correlates to StartupService (FaxOut) of the System Control Service.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>Done.</div><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;"><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><span>10.<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';"><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span>Neither the SM FaxOut nor Common Semantics include an operation correlating to Reprocess-Job. It is not clear how this would act for FaxOut.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>Same as for print I'd think - creates a new job as a copy of an existing one.  But ResubmitJob works that way and also accepts a new job ticket, avoiding the race condition for supplying new values before the job starts processing.</div><div><br></div><div>Perhaps we should deprecate Reprocess-Job for IPP FaxOut and just have Resubmit-Job?</div><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;"><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><span>11.<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';"><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span>Schedule-Job-After correlates to PromoteFaxOutJob. If the predecessor Job is specified, PromoteFaxOutJob acts the same way as the IPP Schedule-Job-After operation.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>Done.</div><div><br></div><div><blockquote type="cite"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;"><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><span>12.<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';"><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span>There is no CancelFaxOutDocument in the FaxOut Service just a CancelFaxOutDocuments (note the 's') although the general semantics operations is Cancel<service>Document . Is this an error in the FaxOut Service spec?</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>Probably.</div><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;"><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><span>13.<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';"><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span>I find no IdentifyFaxOutService under FaxOut, Common Semantics or System Control Service. Should this be added to the SM FaxOut Service (and all other services) or perhaps to System Control Service?</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>It should be part of Common Semantics, with each service getting its own Identify<service>Service operation.</div><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1;"><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><span>14.<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';"><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span>The FaxOut Service identifies the following operations that do not appear in the IPP FaxOut spec:<o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 1in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><span>a.<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';">   <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span>ResubmitFaxOutJob<o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 1in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; text-indent: -0.25in;"><span>b.<span style="font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 7pt; line-height: normal; font-family: 'Times New Roman';">   <span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></span>ValidateFaxOutDocumentTicket</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>Yes, for some reason I missed adding those two operations to the table. Now added (for the next draft...)</div><div><br></div><div>....</div><div><br></div><div>I'll hold off on publishing a new draft until we've had a chance to review the current one, but perhaps we can discuss whether Restart-Job and Reprocess-Job belong in IPP FaxOut, then the next draft will be that much cleaner...</div><div><br></div><div>Thanks!</div><div><br></div><div> <span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: 'Andale Mono'; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: 'Andale Mono'; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">_________________________________________________________<br>Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair</div></span></span> </div> <br></div><br />-- <br />This message has been scanned for viruses and <br />dangerous content by <a href="http://www.mailscanner.info/"><b>MailScanner</b></a>, and is <br />believed to be clean. </body></html>