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<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><br></div>Hi Joe,<div><br></div><div>I think I understand "Configuration State", but to your point, I still don't completely understand what "Certification State" is supposed to represent. Do the parameters that are used to calculate the "Configuration State" overlap or intersect with the parameters that are used to calculate "Certification State", or are these parameters disjoint? Or can the parameter sets used for Configuration State and Certification State be identical?</div><div><br></div><div>Randy</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><div><div>On Aug 15, 2008, at 12:02 PM, Murdock, Joe wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0; "><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div class="Section1"><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Arial Unicode MS', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Randy,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Arial Unicode MS', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Arial Unicode MS', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Don’t confuse the explicitly vendor specific opaque “Configuration State” value with the to be defined “Certification State”. Configuration State is not necessarily intended to be remediated (except, perhaps, by some vendor supplied mechanism). Certification State may, depending on its final definition, be remediable.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Arial Unicode MS', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Arial Unicode MS', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Joe Murdock<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Arial Unicode MS', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); ">Sharp Labs of America<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Arial Unicode MS', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Arial Unicode MS', sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><o:p> </o:p></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; ">Hi Dave,<o:p></o:p></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><o:p> </o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; ">In the proposal, I just indicated that the "value" is a hash - it's currently 32 bytes which only allows for a 256-bit hash. If we mandate that it should be able<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; ">to hold a SHA-512 as well, we'll have to double it's length. I think just getting agreement for the existence of the attribute is the goal, we can flex the size of the<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; ">field once we have consensus on the acceptance of the attribute.<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><o:p> </o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; ">I agree with your comment about which values to include in the hash, but from a protocol perspective, the mechanisms would work pretty much the same way.<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; ">Even though a vendor could allow customers to indicate which parameters are included in the hash, the "management tool in the sky" would have to know which<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; ">parameters make up the hash, on a per-device basis, in order to potentially remediate the situation. Given this constraint, I think vendors should supply a factory<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; ">default set of params that make up the hash, a set that makes sense in the majority of cases, and allow customers to override this, provided they "sync up" their<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; ">remediation infrastructure with the same info...<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><o:p> </o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; ">Randy<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><o:p> </o:p></div></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><o:p> </o:p></div><div><div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; ">On Aug 15, 2008, at 10:31 AM, Dave Whitehead wrote:<o:p></o:p></div></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><br><br><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><br><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">Randy,</span><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br><br><span style="font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; ">Looks good. Two comments about Configuration State:</span><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br><br><span style="font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; ">1> We should mandate the use of a cryptographically secure hash function (SHA256/512)</span><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br><br><span style="font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; ">2> Vendors provide the set of available configuration items but the customer selects which items to include in the hash -- some they care about, some they don't.</span><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br><br><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">David H. Whitehead<br>Development Engineer<br>Lexmark International, Inc.<br>859.825.4914<br>davidatlexmarkdotcom</span><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br><br><o:p></o:p></div><table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellpadding="0" width="100%" style="width: 100%; "><tbody><tr><td width="40%" valign="top" style="width: 40%; padding-top: 0.75pt; padding-right: 0.75pt; padding-bottom: 0.75pt; padding-left: 0.75pt; "><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><b><span style="font-size: 7.5pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">Randy Turner <<a href="mailto:rturner@amalfisystems.com" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">rturner@amalfisystems.com</a>></span></b><span style="font-size: 7.5pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><br><span style="font-size: 7.5pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">Sent by:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:owner-ids@pwg.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">owner-ids@pwg.org</a></span><o:p></o:p></div><p style="margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 7.5pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">08/15/08 04:02 AM</span><o:p></o:p></p></td><td width="59%" valign="top" style="width: 59%; padding-top: 0.75pt; padding-right: 0.75pt; padding-bottom: 0.75pt; padding-left: 0.75pt; "><table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellpadding="0" width="100%" style="width: 100%; "><tbody><tr><td valign="top" style="padding-top: 0.75pt; padding-right: 0.75pt; padding-bottom: 0.75pt; padding-left: 0.75pt; "><div style="text-align: right; margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 7.5pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">To</span><o:p></o:p></div></td><td valign="top" style="padding-top: 0.75pt; padding-right: 0.75pt; padding-bottom: 0.75pt; padding-left: 0.75pt; "><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 7.5pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; "><a href="mailto:ids@pwg.org" style="color: blue; text-decoration: underline; ">ids@pwg.org</a></span><o:p></o:p></div></td></tr><tr><td valign="top" style="padding-top: 0.75pt; padding-right: 0.75pt; padding-bottom: 0.75pt; padding-left: 0.75pt; "><div style="text-align: right; margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 7.5pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">cc</span><o:p></o:p></div></td><td valign="top" style="padding-top: 0.75pt; padding-right: 0.75pt; padding-bottom: 0.75pt; padding-left: 0.75pt; "></td></tr><tr><td valign="top" style="padding-top: 0.75pt; padding-right: 0.75pt; padding-bottom: 0.75pt; padding-left: 0.75pt; "><div style="text-align: right; margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 7.5pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">Subject</span><o:p></o:p></div></td><td valign="top" style="padding-top: 0.75pt; padding-right: 0.75pt; padding-bottom: 0.75pt; padding-left: 0.75pt; "><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 7.5pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">IDS> DRAFT: IETF NEA proposal</span><o:p></o:p></div></td></tr></tbody></table><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><o:p> </o:p></div><table class="MsoNormalTable" border="0" cellpadding="0"><tbody><tr><td valign="top" style="padding-top: 0.75pt; padding-right: 0.75pt; padding-bottom: 0.75pt; padding-left: 0.75pt; "></td><td valign="top" style="padding-top: 0.75pt; padding-right: 0.75pt; padding-bottom: 0.75pt; padding-left: 0.75pt; "></td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody></table><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><br><br><br><tt style="font-family: 'Courier New'; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; ">Hi All,</span></tt><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><br></span><br><tt style="font-family: 'Courier New'; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; ">Please read the attached RTF and provide any feedback you may have...</span></tt><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><br></span><br><tt style="font-family: 'Courier New'; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; ">Please excuse the VERY simple, raw formatting I'm using - this has to be</span></tt><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><br><tt style="font-family: 'Courier New'; ">in the simplest ASCII text form possible for eventual emailing to the</tt><br><tt style="font-family: 'Courier New'; ">NEA</tt><br><tt style="font-family: 'Courier New'; ">mailing list.</tt><br></span><br><tt style="font-family: 'Courier New'; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; ">For now, just concentrate on the content :) :)</span></tt><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><br></span><br><tt style="font-family: 'Courier New'; "><span style="font-size: 10pt; ">Thanks!</span></tt><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; "><br><tt style="font-family: 'Courier New'; ">Randy</tt><br></span><br><br><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; ">[attachment "draft-nea-proposal.rtf" deleted by Dave Whitehead/Lex/Lexmark]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><br><br><o:p></o:p></div></div><div style="margin-top: 0in; margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; margin-bottom: 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><o:p> </o:p></div></div></div></div></span></blockquote></div><br></div></body></html>